from now on it's possible to go bankrupt. If you go negative $50,000 you will lose all your players, academy, facilities and staff. You will get new players and your money will be reset to 0$. This check will be done after the daily update, so you just need to make sure that you won't be under -$50,000 after daily update.
As other important balance factors - there will be more coaches after today's daily update and natural skill decrease is nerfed.
Most of the other day has been spent on tweaking the game simulator and going over the bug list to fix them. The new engine tweaks are not yet live, but I might put them if I manage in time.
Alright, I guess no more lolmanager.gg for me, my team is going to get destroyed. Bye!
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To anyone going bankrupt, you can still reset your team and start over again. But as something I'm going to throw out here, that people who have invested in a scout will probably find this bankruptcy thing going to be pretty good now as there are a lot of free players becoming available after today's daily update.
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Haha Preloa so there is a chance i will remain number 1 in our league ^^.
And regarding the bankruptcy. I love it. I tried to keep my money balance above 0 while still being competetive in my league which i sort of succeeded in. I'm curious who will be on the toplist after this update goes through.
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You wonder who will be on the top list? The people who have bought the bankrupted team's players off the market already of course ;p
This will fix those who went bankrupt, but those players are still alive. Fear them!
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I thing I managed my team pretty well! I'm on top of my league currently undefeated, +20k$ (not much but had to invest a lot in facilities), all my players have 10+ stats in their dominant role, I have been funding my scout since day 1. The update should reward players who've been trying to play "fair" if i can use this term.
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First of all: I'm not directly affected by this.
What the hell were the devs thinking? I mean, yes, this is a beta, but you still have some sort of responsibility. At least give people a grace period to let them adapt to that.
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I do like this change, a lot actually. People had like 10 Days from now on in order to adjust their team and who has -50k or more just managed wrong and failed.
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@Joba
While I do agree that an advance notice of the Bankruptcy would've been ideal...teams who have more than $50k in debt have been abusing a broken Academy system; that's the ONLY reason they can be in that much debt and stay in that much debt (or just have so horribly managed their teams that they need to restart anyway).
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@Joba:
Our reasoning is to keep the things moving faster and this is why we are doing rather swift decisions.
As for why I didn't see it as too big of a problem by introducing the bankruptcy system a little quicker:
1) It's extremely difficult to get out from -$50,000 negative stance in the first place and when being this negative you can't use most of the games features properly due to limits and will start to spiral even further down.
2) There aren't too many teams that are below the bankruptcy point actually.
--------------------- However if most people feel that there should have been a grace period, I would have no problem starting the bankruptcy system in the later future. Or I could change the bankruptcy point lower and make it slowly go back to -$50,000.
So I would like to know your opinion on this.
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50k is a pretty big cushion and everyone knew something was coming. As for the players still being in the system at least they will be a lot more spread out now.
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Well guys I think that u get kinda too dramatic about the changes. First of all, why do u even care about stayin on top? It's just a beta, so there's no place for trying hard because everything might go reset the next day. We are supposed to help the team which is working on this game, not try hard, use bugs and stuff to get ahead. Your position doesn't matter cause it will be gone soon anyway, when the game will go stable version. Stop carin about ur position, and ur stuff in game, start helpin dev team. Ok negative balance, fine u spot sth that shouldn't happen, post a msg, instead of using it. Otherwise the beta will just get longer, and I guess everyone would like to play normally on stable game. In the end where's the fun, if u play on sth thats not completed and is some test version?
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Also how did I never notice Loagic was that far in debt? I thought he was legit for some reason.
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Like I stated before I like the move and I would'nt take it back
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It's not hard at all to get out of bancruptcy. I make 10K a day, soon 12K and more as better sponsors become available.
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I, for myself also "abused" the broken academy system. I was about 70k in debt but I quickly recovered from it as I managed to quickly climb the ladder and get better sponsors. A friend of mine ("Preloa"/"Loagic Gaming") did the same thing, just a little later and with 50.000$ players, and, while he would also be able to recover from that, now he can't. The better way to handle this situation is simply fix the academy, which isn't really too hard. (Just stop as soon as someone doesn't have enough money to pay for the new player).
My opinion on this is, that there should be more communication with the community and we should be more involved with more possibilities to give our input.
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You know, I was wondering how people managed to bid $7,500+ on coaches that were middling at best. Now I know.
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They said a bunch of times they were fixing the academy bug and adding penalties for players in debt. If you are going to make a habit of abusing known bugs after they announce they are trying to fix them it's important to pay attention to their progress :) For next time. Or just do what everyone else did and just report the bug and try to keep the game running smoothly.
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@Joba: I see your point and I agree that there should be a grace period. The bankruptcy script will not run today - so we have more time for discussion and making the decision - and I will decide tomorrow when the process starts and in which manner exactly.
Meanwhile discussion on the issue is appreciated.
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unlucky, that i went into -xxxxx, before you announced it.
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Well RIP, I am 150k in debt xD
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I think a lot of people are not taking the long term implications of going in debt into account. Yes, my players are stronger than most right now, but i am also stuck with them for the next half month. Im not going to be able to purchase anything. Going into that much debt is a long term investment with an early powerspike but those teams will fall of soon, especially without the chance to upgrade their facilities.
Furthermore, the only time i see the planned bancrupty system being relevant at all, is right now. The fixed academy and bitting limit on coaches makes it pretty hard to go into debt from now on. And by the time you would eventually hit -50k the bancrupty system would be the least of your problems.
Therefore it seems to me it is only meant to reset the teams of the players that "abused" the academy, which was never forbidden in the first place. And by the time it got announced that there will be debt punishment it was far too late for those players. You can't reverse a long term investment in a couple days.
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I think it would be even easier now with the more coaching focused game once you save up 100k for the dive like people did with academy. (If it was never addressed)
It would be kind of nice if something went effect fairly soon. Otherwise the guys that brought the issue to light get punished instead of those trying to keep it secret while they exploit it. The announcement was that it would be fixed fairly soon.
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@Preloa
That seems to be precisely the case. It's likely they want to do this so they can properly judge skill decay and coach-management in a healthy manner. You can't purchase coaches or upgrade facilities when you're in debt, so it means that those who are in debt right now are useless to the testing environment. Besides, if they can't get coaches, their players will just decay anyway.
They're forcing them to restart now rather than letting them bleed out (on top of being useless to testing).
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Maybe like a 3-5 day grace period before the -50k thing goes into effect?
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They are very useful to the testing environment because they try something, that wasn't intended. These players will find alternative ways, while not intended, might actually work out. If you force everyone to do the exact same thing while testing, you won't get any interesting results.
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Yes...but...with the current systems, they abused certain "broken" concepts. That's an "emotional" response, though.
In all practicality, however, even without the Auto-Bankruptcy coming into effect, they would still be unable to purchase coaches and upgrade facilities due to being in the red. That's not healthy, and their players will decay in skill until they're absolutely worthless.
Thus, they won't be able to maintain their overpowered players at all.
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I have done it myself and you get out of debt quick enough to not be overpowered. You got some sort of peak where you can reach the top #3 but after that you fall back to ~#100-#200. This has advantages and disadvantages and it's up to the players to chose their playstyle. Removing that option is fine, punishing players who weren't abusing a bug (this wasn't a bug) is not fine.
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The Fact that everyone losing thier team due to bankrupcy essentially stated ya i abused the broken youth academy system should tell you the need to fix the academy and yes this is a good first step
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Ok, this might sound a bit harsh now, don't take it the wrong way. The devs were unable to implement a working academy system, and while that happens and the system itself should get fixed, it is simply unfair to reset players who are not responsible for this. The players - as everyone is saying here - do not have an advantage, but rather a disadvantage (in your opinion). What's the problem then? Just let them play and everyone who wants to reset is already able to do so.
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@Joba I hope you realise that we are actually playing a game that is still currently in BETA. We are essentially trying to help build this into a better game with the devs (In fact, I am quite thankful that people abused the academy system so that the devs can fix it right after.) Regarding the grace period, I do hope that the devs will implement it in the ACTUAL RELEASE. As of now, its really pointless. Unless you REALLY want to keep your top spot and your bragging rights, all of the achievements will soon reset.
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To many people acting like this will be thier team forever naming schemes admittedly had to be addressed after the way the game started but the largest issue this entire cycle has been the youth academy and the broken bidding process on coaches fixing the academy for next test cycle is crucial just fixing the systems won't do.
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Again, the academy is already fixed. Also the Beta argument works in both ways.
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how is the academy already you can still sign and hire same day. Thats not what an academy should be
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If you are refering to that part of the academy, it is broken. We we are talking about the possibility to hire players even after you're broke - and that's maybe not how it should be, but it does not give you am advantage, thus fixing that without resetting the teams who are in debt is the better choice since there is less frustration. Even in a Beta developers have certain responsibilities and should make sure to keep frustration to a minimum.
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Thanks for the discussion. It helps a lot to improve the game. What do you think should the minimal waiting period for the academy be? 1 season which is around 19 days of league + a little waiting period before the next season. Say 22 days?
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I need a 60k budget to buy facilities for 30k. this is kinda lame. if I can afford it why do my budget has to be twice as much. as long as I think I can afford it. I should be allowed to buy it. else you migth as well just have a bot playing since you can't make your own decisions...
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If the player is 15 1 season if the player is 14 2 seasons seems like it'd be best and a player can be kept til 17 if not hired after that they become free agents
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@Henri that sounds fair, however keep in mind that if you wait 22 days until you get the players, they also have to be better than now (unless you intend to heavily nerf the players you get out of the academy)
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I wanna bring up the point mccrane talked about before. Do you really think it's needed to have the double amount of money you need to upgrade/buy a feature in your facilities? Personally I feel like that this was probably a bit rushed in order to do something against bankruptcy. I totally get that this might be needed when you want to hire coaches since the costs for them are pretty high on a daily basis, While the facilities are more like a investment at once with little side costs. Is it just me who thinks like that? I can't really understand why you need 80k to upgrade something that costs 40k straight up and like 1-2k daily. Just my opinion tho.
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I believe this whole "you need 10x time the money" thing was to temporary prevent player for going into red, while the bankruptcy system was not implemented. Now that it will have some effect to be in the red, why not remove this limit ? If some player want to fuck himself up with bidding 100k on a coach, let him, he will lose his team the following day.
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It was a rushed decision, but there was basis behind the decision that perhaps whoever is maintaining or providing the service for you would want to make sure that you have enough funds to pay for a certain period of maintenance as well.
But the fact that you need to have double the money or just any other arbitrary amount of money over what the item costs also adds another dynamic to the game - another resource which is simply the potential to buy. So it becomes good to always have some spare money, because it's valuable to you even if you don't spend it.
So there is some logic behind it and it does add some dynamic to the game.
The way I see it right now it: + Makes going into negative for new starters more difficult. + Adds another dynamic to the game where it rewards having a bigger budget and so it becomes strategic to achieve that budget.
- It might seem like a weird and unexpected restriction. - It makes the game hold player's hand too much?
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Well the problem you forgot is that it give heavy budget team a horrible advantage over the small teams.
Let's say a small team, but with a good steady income, want to invest 2k on a coach (it seems fine in my opinion). This investment is vital for this team management plan. But, this team will always lose to big teams that will be able to propose 10k to the coach, even if it means going into negative income. I believe big teams should be able to hire several coach with reasonnable salary, so a little team could compete with a big team on at least ONE coach (and that one coach wouldn't mean much to the big team, she can hire several other with no probs, while for the little team it means a lot).
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That's how I feel too whiden. I personally think I managed my team pretty well but I personally do not always have a lot of money in the backhand. I like to invest it and take risks, while ofc always remaining a good money household. I feel like I should not have disadvantages due to that. The you need to have x-amount of the real price rule seems reasonable to a certain amount or feature (looking at the coaching system) but should be reworked in other parts in my opinion. It basically makes it almost impossible for managers to go in debt/take wrong decisions (which is too much in my opinion). Afterall its your game and we are just giving input.. if you want to make it that noob-friendly (no offense) its your way to handle the game and I gonna accept it.
