I threw this idea around on discord for a while, one of the biggest factors with the game at the moment is all lanes meet up in the middle, trade blows and kill each other in 15 seconds. Kill is defacto the best option because if your opponent is trying to kill you and you aren't trying to kill them, they will win.
This causes a very random situation where the player who starts attacking first or gets a lucky extra damage wins essentially. This causes a snowball effect where the opposing laner can-not catch up and essentially is useless.
Kill meta causes, Junglers unable to gank lanes because they are not alive long enough to complete a gank. Utility doesn't work in lane because players need combat stats. Vision is useless because junglers don't gank. Players don't farm because they are always dying or going back to base.
The removal of Kill as a meta can be tested on the current server, I tried it a few times and the games looked more normal. I do predict harass may become the defacto option, but at least many of the above options will be less impactful.
By nerfing kill, this would also offer the chance of a major meta change to take place without much work. Sure testing would be great.
2
Nerfing kill would allow a lot more meta diversity and allow a lot more fluidity in the game. 100% support.
4
posting to get tims credit card from his mum
5
Interesting point. Yet I'm not sure the kill is at the center of the issue. Kills have always been an important part of any MOBA, and so it should stay important here. The real issue I see in the current meta is the incapacity for the "losing" team to adapt. I mean, it's a legit strategy to go for harass or kill in order to take the lead and then snowball the game. What's not cool is that, when things go wrong (better opponent, or some random trade that goes against you?), there is nothing to make your players adapt their behavior. They are behind but they will brainlessly follow their harass/kill order. In real MOBA, when you offer 1 kill or 2, you will play less aggressively and then you rely more on farming or the help of a mate (jungler, roaming...). Which never happens here, as your players will keep the same basic orders you set in your default strat.
So maybe we could get more parameters in our strats: like a behavior to follow by default, when leading (with a gold lead to be set manually?) or when losing (same?). Or maybe the players/teams could adapt automatically when falling behind (while trying to follow the same strat). After what if the snowball effect is still too strong, so reduce the income of a kill (or a way to compensate?) could be necessary.
My 2 cents
2
I will think about what to do short term and whether it's important. But there are plans to do a new more detailed and idealistic sim in few months, but if enough of userbase feels that tweaks to the current one would be important then I'd do it.
1
i made a topic about kill status a while ago, i agree that kill should be nerfed / tweaked. i played a game vs my smurf where both teams had grp at 40 and farm with a ganking jungler, was much more fun and enjoyable then the 13 cs adc who goes 0-16 because he keeps fighting
1
Perhaps if someone has 'KILL' set as strategy then maybe it's just enough to make the 'KILL' guy more vulnerable as if he was getting minion aggro.
1
I think another problem is if you set a lane to farm he only gets ~10 cs more than the enemie or even get outfarmed.
1
Is there shutdown gold if you kill someone on rampage?
2
I think another problem is if you set a lane to farm he only gets ~10 cs more than the enemie or even get outfarmed.
3
@Henri. Glad there is a new game engine in the works. I am suggesting this as a short term tweek that could really benifit the game but also change the meta completely, giving everyone the fun of finding a new strategy for themselves. Small tweeks to the game sim every so often can make the game feel new and give us a new challenge even if the tweeks aren't big ones.
2
My only fear is that this game will end up trying to be too much like League or something else. I like that it has its own meta, and the meta will change. Don't be scared to have a weird thing like this, because it's just a sign that enough people want to try weird strategies. If you remove that, I'm scared this game will lose its charm.
2
@EGPrime, I think it's near impossible to replicate actual League, but I agree it should be it's own game in it's own right.
This is coming from several of the guys who are at the top of the elo charts, who understand how the strategy works out and what effects the current meta. By removing the kill option in laning phase it opens up more options for strategy. Currently the meta is stale, boring, figured out. I inform loads of new player about the meta and there haven't really been any adaptations for a while. Other than a few minor changes I have not changed my strategy in over a week. I have not really seen any new changes to the meta in over a month.
I am proposing with nerfing this single option, it will change a whole world of strategy stuff in game that affects everything. If you have ever been around for the strategy changes, you will know how much fun it can be, how much more interesting it makes the game for a few weeks maybe a few months. The game will still have it's own meta that doesn't reflect league but it will be fresh and new.
1
Hey no, I fully agree. I think that kills should be less important, I'm just hearing a lot of talk about the support/jungle meta because of this, and I think it's healthy for the game to have its own, strange strategy to it - rather than trying to fit champions to their League counterparts.
2
Oh yea, support jungle is interesting and it was fun discovering it, but it's old. Support jungle may still live even without kill lanes. This is the thing about meta change, who knows what is next?
